News

Verizon Hopes to Kill iPhone with Voyager

Thursday, October 4th, 2007 at 8:45 AM - by

Verizon unveiled its Voyager cell phone on Wednesday that is designed to compete with Apple's iPhone. Verizon's Chief Marketing Officer, Mike Lanman, is so sure Voyager will trump Apple's offering that he dubbed in an iPhone killer, according to Reuters.

"We think it'll be the best phone... this year," he said. "It will kill the iPhone."


Verizon's iPhone competitor: Voyager

The company hopes its offering will give iPhone the knock down by offering some similar features along with a fold-out mini keyboard. Like the iPhone, it will include a touch-sensitive interface, a Web browser, and a two megapixel digital camera.

Despite Verizon's high hopes, the Voyager may not hit Apple as hard as the company would like.

"People who want a high-end media phone and want to stay with Verizon will certainly give that one a hard look. I don't know that it would pull anybody away from an iPhone," said Avi Greengart, an analyst for Current Analysis.

Verizon isn't sharing yet what the Voyager will cost, but it is expected to come in around US$400 to match the iPhone's $399 price tag. The company plans to ship the Voyager before the end of November.

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mahuti said:

member since 09 Jan 2003 with 371 posts, TMO Staff, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:34 am

Elegance.... will it have it? Doubtful. Cell phone companies are under the assumption that features alone draw users. Elegance is the draw of the iPhone. For instance, the touch screen keyboard on the iPhone is so dialed in that it doesn't require a fold out keyboard as far as I'm concerned. This announcement if "iPhone killer" smacks as hunger for free press on a device that is sure to prove itself as woefully outclassed.

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Tiger said:

member since 17 Jun 2003 with 971 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:45 am

Verizon...again an also ran. "See, we can make one too."

If immitation is the sincerest form of flattery, the iPhone is the Apple of everyone's eye!

Give me a break people. Won't any of these companies go out and design something ORIGINAL?????????????????????????

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:54 am

What hath Apple wrought? Competition is a good thing and Apple has set the standard for others to meet. If they do, then it is good for everybody.

Let a thousand smartphones bloom!

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Sir Harry Flashman said:

member since 08 Feb 2007 with 721 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:02 am

I wonder how users will synch the "killer" with their computer. How do you get music onto it and photos off, how do you synch your address book? Is there a synch cable, a dock, or do you email stuff to an fro? The article doesn't say much about that, well I didn't see it anywhere in the Reuter's article. There is more to the usability of a device than raw technical features. Without an easy way to synch with your computer I don't see this product sinking the iPhone.

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vasic said:

member since 09 Aug 2005 with 255 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:08 am

Mahuti,

Exactly my thoughts. If you are releasing a new product, try to get as much free publicity as you can by riding the coattails of some media star. Nobody in their sane mind could think that this device stands any chance against the iPhone. The world seems to agree that iPhone was a revolutionary product, a game changer, a paradigm shift. The new Verizon (actually an LG) device is another in the sea of phones, albeit somewhat sexier, sleeker and more feature-rich than the rest of the competition. And that is precisely where it will be - competing with the other non-iPhones. It will do well if it is subsidised down to $200 after rebates/subsidy.

I will repeat what I said before, as I think it is worth remembering.

My wife and I have two Sony-Ericsson W600i walkman phones. She uses it to make and receive calls, check her voicemail and occasionally snap a picture with the camera (which I then have to download, since she doesn't know how). I use it to listen to MP3s, FM radio, snap pictures and capture video, listen to and view podcasts, store files (as a flash drive), check news/weather on its (crappy) browser, check my e-mail, tether it to my MacBook...

When I buy an iPhone for my wife (probably this Christmas), she will be able to:

1. Make and receive calls and check voice mail (visually);

2. Show off pictures of our kids on it;

3. Manage her music, listen to mp3s and podcasts, watch TV shows and movies;

4. Check and respond to her e-mail;

5. Surf the web on it;

6. Check the weather on it;

7. Find the nearest Crate & Barrel stores;

8. Watch YouTube when stuck on a bus...

All this without (and this is the most important part) EVER ASKING ME FOR HELP. The point is obviously not so much about relieving me from tech support role in our family; it is about the intuitiveness of the device. THAT is what defines a game-changer, a paradigm-shifter a (insert your own similar euphemism) revolutionary device.

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JonGl said:

member since 12 Jan 2006 with 102 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:10 am

If they _really_ wanted to create an iPhone killer, they would charge less than the exact same price. I don't think they really expect it to be an iPhone killer. They are just capitalizing on the name and notoriety they hope to gain (read hype) from their claims.

And like others, I'm really curious as to how well this will work with my Mac, syncing names calendars, etc. Also, will it even be as functional as my Palm?

-Jon

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burrito said:

member since 07 Aug 2005 with 177 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:20 am

"killer" = "knockoff"

people will see this thing and the first thought they will have is that LG is creating their own knockoff iphone. people want the real thing, and will want the status achieved by owning an iphone, and obtaining one of these will do exactly the opposite.

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Brutno said:

member since 28 Aug 2002 with 195 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:52 am

I agree with Vasic - Verizon wants/needs publicity - especially after passing on the iPhone when they had the chance. Now that they have everyone's attention, it is Verizon's turn to do something with it. We'll know exactly how Verizon really feels about this phone by how they sell it. If they heavily subsidize it eventually then we'll know they either cannot compete or they view it internally as a me-too product.

Burrito - While I agree with your sentiments and feel there is a target market that echoes the thoughts you've presented, I also feel there is a huge quantity of phone users who will buy a me-too product because it's just good enough. (Lord knows they do it with operating systems.) They'll take one look at a Voyager and declare it to be just as good as an iPhone, whether or not it is. IMHO this is Verizon's target market - the vast uneducated masses.

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Oct 04, 2007 11:44 am

Most iPhone users are already locked to a two-year contract. Not a lot of killing is going to be happening until those contracts expire, if even then (I highly doubt it).

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Sir Harry Flashman said:

member since 08 Feb 2007 with 721 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 11:53 am

Guest wrote:
Most iPhone users are already locked to a two-year contract. Not a lot of killing is going to be happening until those contracts expire, if even then (I highly doubt it).

True, but the majority of the cell phone users do not have an iPhone, or even a smart phone of any sort, and are not the AT&T service. Those are folks who will be targeted by this killer.

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Oct 04, 2007 12:44 pm

So, is this supposed to be the "iPhone for people who hate AT&T and/or Apple" ?

It reminds me of the Zune or Creative products being the "iPod killers for people who hate Apple" and we all know how that turned out.

Nowadays, with the history of so many (insert Apple product's name here)-killers waiting in the shelves or resting in the landfills, the word "killer" is beginning to carry a heavy "not as good as the original" connotation in many people's minds. If I were in charge of Verizon's marketing I'd carefully avoid using it.

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:10 pm

yawn...

Verizzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzon...

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daemon said:

member since 17 May 2007 with 309 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:24 pm

It's sad to see that everyone feels a need to market their products by saying it's an Apple product killer. Let's face it, this thing could generate 16 oz bars of gold every time you hit the pound key and just about everyone on this site would rag on it simply because it wasn't Apple that was embosed on it's back. We all know that Foxconn is the most likely actual manufacturer of the iPhone as Apple doesn't make a single one of their own consumer electronic devices themselves but rather buys them from a chinese manufacturer and rebrands 'em. I bet dollars to donuts that this Voyager is being made in the same plant as the iPhone and the manufacturer is laughing uproarously at all the stupid Americans while they rake in our money.

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Dirt Road said:

member since 24 Oct 2002 with 1237 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:48 pm

Verizon doesn't have a real iPhone. That's not their problem. Verizon's real problem is that they take very capable phones and cripple them. The Moto phones that the wife & daughter have are blessed with a mini-USB port that can be used to... charge the phone. Verizon has crippled their ability to transfer files (pictures out, ringtones in, whatever), and I'm not even sure you can sync the address book. Same with Bluetooth phones.

This Voyager thing could go far beyond the iPhone (unlikely, but go with it for a moment), but if Verizon doesn't let it breathe it's gonna suffocate on the shelf.

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Oct 04, 2007 2:05 pm

Ease of use has always been Apple's way. And people are finding out that Apple's way is the better way. The iPhone 100% proves this the minute someone touches it. Verizon is fantasy island if they think there phone will do anything to the iPhone. It's just another Windows based phone with another fold out keyboard like all the other Windows phones, big deal. It still means you are going to have to dig 4 levels down to get at the information you want just like all the other phones out there.

That's what sets the iPhone apart as well. The last thing is that it is running OSX which is the clincher and nobody can copy that.

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Intruder said:

member since 07 Jul 2004 with 3012 posts, TMO Mac Specialist, send him a message or view his profile

Thu Oct 04, 2007 2:44 pm

daemon wrote:
It's sad to see that everyone feels a need to market their products by saying it's an Apple product killer. Let's face it, this thing could generate 16 oz bars of gold every time you hit the pound key and just about everyone on this site would rag on it simply because it wasn't Apple that was embosed on it's back. We all know that Foxconn is the most likely actual manufacturer of the iPhone as Apple doesn't make a single one of their own consumer electronic devices themselves but rather buys them from a chinese manufacturer and rebrands 'em. I bet dollars to donuts that this Voyager is being made in the same plant as the iPhone and the manufacturer is laughing uproarously at all the stupid Americans while they rake in our money.

Rebrand? That implies that it was an existing design that Apple took and put their name on it, which is not the case. The ZUNE v1 could rightfully be called a rebranded Toshiba Gigabeat, but I don't think that is a valid thing to say about the iPhone. Apple has contracted a company to manufacture the iPhone (and iPod and whatever else) based upon a design created and owned by Apple, and are not rebranding anything. Semantics? Maybe, but a very important distinction in the manufacturing world.

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Oct 04, 2007 3:41 pm

The lame LG Voyager doesn't do WiFi.

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Oct 04, 2007 5:15 pm

I don't own an iPhone. And with Apple's current attitude, I won't own one any time soon.

It's sad, really. I switched to Cingular a year before the announcement, because it looked like Cingular was the most likely carrier to get it first. I wouldn't do a 2 year contract, because I wanted the Apple phone when it came out.

And then the rumors started getting bad. First, it was that it would be locked to a carrier - annoying, but livable. And then the rumor that there would be no API - Apple would write all the software. That's a deal killer in itself. Then that it wouldn't have 3g - another deal killer. And, worst of all, it wasn't going to be usable as a modem - ok, I can't own one of these if that's true.

And ALL of those nasty rumors were true. The iPhone would be great - if it were unlocked, had an API for developers, had 3g, and could be tethered to a laptop as a modem. And people keep buying them. It amazes me.

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Oct 04, 2007 5:49 pm

Guest wrote:
And people keep buying them. It amazes me.

It amazes me, too, but I guess that's why we're commenting on what Apple does and Steve Jobs is running the company.

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daemon said:

member since 17 May 2007 with 309 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:15 am

There's no definitive way to say who designed what without the inside story. That said, I view anything that is manufactured by a third party company that is then sold with the first party's brand on it to be rebranding. Foxconn has a long history of making the best computer parts in the world for other companies to rebrand and sell as theirs'.

So to recap, if company A owns manufacturing plant C then any product that is made at manufacturing plant C and sold by A under A's brands is not rebranding. But when B owns C and sells the products to A to sell to the public under their brand, then it is rebranding.

Foxconn is an Original Design Manufacturer, they design and make products for other companies to brand as their own.

ODM

Which ODMs benefit

Intruder wrote:
daemon wrote:
It's sad to see that everyone feels a need to market their products by saying it's an Apple product killer. Let's face it, this thing could generate 16 oz bars of gold every time you hit the pound key and just about everyone on this site would rag on it simply because it wasn't Apple that was embosed on it's back. We all know that Foxconn is the most likely actual manufacturer of the iPhone as Apple doesn't make a single one of their own consumer electronic devices themselves but rather buys them from a chinese manufacturer and rebrands 'em. I bet dollars to donuts that this Voyager is being made in the same plant as the iPhone and the manufacturer is laughing uproarously at all the stupid Americans while they rake in our money.

Rebrand? That implies that it was an existing design that Apple took and put their name on it, which is not the case. The ZUNE v1 could rightfully be called a rebranded Toshiba Gigabeat, but I don't think that is a valid thing to say about the iPhone. Apple has contracted a company to manufacture the iPhone (and iPod and whatever else) based upon a design created and owned by Apple, and are not rebranding anything. Semantics? Maybe, but a very important distinction in the manufacturing world.

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Intruder said:

member since 07 Jul 2004 with 3012 posts, TMO Mac Specialist, send him a message or view his profile

Fri Oct 05, 2007 11:44 am

There is no indication that Foxconn is acting as an ODM in Apple's case. Apple's history is to design their own hardware, then (at least in the last several years) outsource the manufacturing. Foxconn does act as a design manufacturer for some companies, but with Apple is most likely a contract manufacturer (based on Apple past history). Foxconn (Hon Hai) does both, depending on what they have been asked to do.

Your a>b>c definition isn't correct for contract manufacturers. It would be correct for design manufacturers.

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ctopher said:

member since 25 Aug 2006 with 102 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Fri Oct 05, 2007 1:28 pm

daemon,

Do you really think Apple would buy and re-brand someone else's product? There's no way. Apple never made a retail iPod in their own factories, but the iPod is most assuredly an original Apple design. They pride themselves on their design. What about all those APPLE patents that cover the iPhone? The inventors were not Chinese or Hong Kong citizens, they are Apple employees who assigned their inventions to Apple Inc.

Also, no modern company owns all their own manufacturing anymore. It doesn't make sense. Foxconn, Flextronics, Solectron and a few other Asian manufacturers (the last 2 merged last June) do the lion's share of consumer electronic manufacturing and there are a whole host of others in China, India, Brazil, and don't forget the maquiladoras in Mexico.

Now, ODMs are on the rise. Those companies who honed their manufacturing skills and took advantage of their relatively low labor costs are finally seeing a flattening in their business. So where do they turn? To design. But they are nowhere as sophisticated as Apple is today. Will they ever be? I would not count them out, but as of today, they are designing incremental improvements, not game changers.

Also, a company may chose an ODM as opposed to their own design when it's not a core product. Suppose I'm an electronics company with a great name and excellent TV designs, but no radios. Well my engineers COULD design a radio, but since there are many mature designs why not just purchase one from an ODM company and put my company's good name on it. The risks are low because radios are a mature technology. The radios will sell because they have a trusted name behind/on them.

There may be an example or two out there, but I don't know of a revolutionary product that ORIGINATED at an ODM. Certainly the iPhone is not one.

I think I can definitely say that Apple is NOT re-branding someone else's design.

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ctopher said:

member since 25 Aug 2006 with 102 posts, unranked, send him a message or view his profile

Fri Oct 05, 2007 1:45 pm

daemon,

I neglected to go to the links you provided before my previous post. Those links help bolster my case about Apple and ODMs. The Wikipedia article you reference states: "A primary attribute of this business model is that the ODM owns and/or designs in-house the products that are branded by the buying firm. This is in contrast to a contract manufacturer (CM)."

Open an iPhone box and it will clearly say that it was designed by Apple. The people who actually make it are contract manufacturers (CMs). There are also EMS (Electronic manufacturing services) companies who will handle more of the supply chain.

Your second reference never mentions ODMs except to refer to the source as "Morgan Stanley's Taiwan-based original design manufacturer analysts". In fact, the discussion is about which various CMs that supply components for iPods will gain or lose business with the new iPod designs. None of the companies mentioned actually assemble the final iPod, they all do some kind of specialized process (aluminum extrusion, aluminum die-casting, the manufacture of some magnesium inner parts, etc.)

In fact that points out a really good reason to use a CM for these products. There are companies that do a really good job of making high precision magnesium parts. IF Apple were to try to make their own iPods they would have to develop the people, machines and skills to manufacture those parts. Never mind that there are also plastic, aluminum, stainless steel and god knows what else that needs to be machined or other wise formed to make the parts that make up the whole.

Now, the obvious end game is the ODM, but don't think for a minute that the iPhone is an ODM product.

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A guest said: (hide)

Fri Oct 05, 2007 3:02 pm

I got to play with one of these iphone killers since I work at Verizon and it is certainly a very pretty phone. It also has exterior speakers which the iphone lacks as well as one of those useless cell phone cameras that for some reason everyone wants. it's much thicker than the iphone because it's hiding a full fat keyboard inside which was very nice.

Where iphone beats this entry is in the user interface. it was hard to know where to go and what to push. There's a lot packed into a little phone so you can bet the user manual will be extensive. I was also annoyed that the little device kept switching between landscape and normal mode whenever it felt like it (i.e. videos), unlike the iphone which just detects which way you're holding it. The touch screen was also somewhat useless. more of an iphone gimic than a useful feature.

A nice phone, and it will certainly run faster on Verizon's network, but iphone still has it beat.

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A guest said: (hide)

Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:29 am

I've been having so many problems with my iPhone that I am searching for a replacement. I was going to replace it with the Pearl 2, but now I need to go into a store and put my hands on this device to see if it will do what I need. I really don't need video on my phone (even though the Pearl supports it), the thing this could really bring me, which is the one feature I don't want to lose from the iPhone, is a nice browser. The new Pearl has WiFi, and those are really the only two features of the iPhone that I think are better than other phones, everything else, especially doing email on it, frustrates me to no end. So while this phone may not be the one that pulls me away from the iPhone, it might be second runner up to the Pearl 2.

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A guest said: (hide)

Thu Nov 08, 2007 1:28 pm

Allow me to End any questions. I fpund this on http://www.comparati.com/890-LG-Voyager-vs-iPhone

Feature wire the Voyager wins over the Iphone.

**FEATURES EXCLUSIVE TO Voyager (only facts)- _________________________________________ Removable battery, GPS, faster G3 network, 2nd internal screen, full QWERTY keyboard, multimedia messaging, upgradeable sd memory, mobile Tv, auto focus camera, camcorder, insurable, vibe touch, bluetooth printing, stereo bluetooth, bluetooth for dialup, bluetooth wireless sync, dual stereo speakers, text to speech, reinforced outer touch screen, voice dialing, comfort grip, voice recorder/conversation recorder, video/animated wallpaper, one touch speaker phone, dual display setting for self portraits, camera flash, 2.5 digital zoom, Third party support, and Calendar Data input, screen 240 x 400 (80x80 smaller), dimensions- 4.64in (h) x 2.12in (w) x 0.71 in thick, 4.69 ounces width (.26in smaller width), 4.69 oz.(0.11oz lighter).

**FEATURES EXCLUSIVE TO Iphone (only facts)- _________________________________________ Offers WiFi, Multitouch screen, internal 4/8 gigs, Accelerometer (senses phone position), ambient light sensor, 5 hours talk time, visual voicemail, Safari Browser, screen 320 x 480 (80x80 bigger), dimensions- 4.5in (h) x 2.4in (w) x 0.46in thick, 4.8 ounces, Length 4.5 in (0.14in smaller height), (.25in in smaller thickness).

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A guest said: (hide)

Sat Dec 08, 2007 9:35 pm

whoever posted about the voyager exclusive features is a retard.

*FEATURES EXCLUSIVE TO Voyager (only facts)- _________________________________________ Removable battery, GPS, faster G3 network, 2nd internal screen, full QWERTY keyboard IPHONE HAS THIS, multimedia messaging IPHONE HAS THIS, upgradeable sd memory, mobile Tv IHONE HAS THIS ITS CALLED PICK YOUR SHOWS OFF ITUNES AND YOU HAVE FULL EPISODES AT YOUR REACH WHENEVER WHEREVER AND IT DOESNT DEPEND ON YOUR WIRELESS CONNECTIVITY, auto focus camera IPHONE HAS THIS, camcorder, insurable, vibe touch, bluetooth printing, stereo bluetooth, bluetooth for dialup, bluetooth wireless sync, dual stereo speakers IPHONE HAS THIS, text to speech, reinforced outer touch screen IPHONE HAS THIS, voice dialing, comfort grip, voice recorder/conversation recorder, video/animated wallpaper, one touch speaker phone IPHONE HAS THIS, dual display setting for self portraits, camera flash, 2.5 digital zoom, Third party support, and Calendar Data input IPHONE HAS THIS, screen 240 x 400 (80x80 smaller), dimensions- 4.64in (h) x 2.12in (w) x 0.71 in thick, 4.69 ounces width (.26in smaller width), 4.69 oz.(0.11oz lighter). ALSO I DONT KNOW IF THE MAKERS OF VOYAGER HAVE AN ENTIRE OPERATIING SYSTEM ON THIS CHEAP EXMAPLE OF AN IPHONE WNNABE BUT IPHONE DOES. ANOTHER POINT HOW DOES THIS NEW "IPHONE KILLER" CONNECT TO YOUR COMPUTER/ DO YOU PLUG IT IN AND IT AUTOMATICALLY UPDATES EVERYTHING YOU HAVE SET IN YOUR SETTINGS MENU IN ITUNES (EVERYONE HAS ITUNES I MEAN SERIOUSLY GET WITH THE TIMES IF YOU DONT). LAST POINT ANY PERSON WALKING AROUND WITH THE NEW "IPHONE KILLER" WILL BE EMBARRASSED TO HAVE IT BECAUSE HAVING AN IPHONE MYSLEF I KNOW IF I SAW SOMEONE WITH IT ID BE LIKE SWEET IPHONE WANNABE, AND WHAT WOULD THEY SAY "ITS NOT A COPY OF IPHONE". YAWWWNN EVERY PHONE COMPANY WISHES THEY HAD IPHONE SO THEY ARE COPYING IT. TOO BAD THEY SUCK.

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